Talk:Tom Riddle/Archive 1

Merge with Lord Voldemort
We have a Lord Voldemort thread. They are the same two people, just different ages. Can this be a candidate for deletion?

I think they should be merged

I think we should have a vote. Keep both, Merge, Delete LV, Delete TMR.Ginny Potter-Weasley 12:43, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

I vote Merge Ginny Potter-Weasley 12:43, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

I think they need to stay separate, as they are in essence two different people. Tom Riddle is the man, Voldemort is the result of splitting himself into the Horcrux pieces. He is no longer a man, but a monster. For that fact I think they need to stay separate. TSummers 13:21, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

They're the same person. Voldemort is the name he chose to give the world, ergo; this article should be merged into Lord Voldemort, not the other way around, and Definitely not kept as-is. Din&#39;s Fire 997 20:18, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

I vote to merge. Therequiembellishere 19:53, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Well, I feel like Riddle is just an alias for the larger Voldemort. I think that this should not be deleted but needs to be heavily changed to reflect that Riddle is simply the alias of the man. HPisawesome 23:42, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

I think they need to be kept separate because they are 2 different people. Voldemort is a dark lord that everyone fears. Tom is a Hogwarts student who becomes misguided and transforms. Its almost like Darth Vader. Anakin just becomes misguided. Stryker
 * But even the wookiepedia has Anakin Skywalker and Darth Vader under the same page. Therequiembellishere 04:49, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I say merge and keep article under the name Tom Riddle with Voldemort redirecting there as Tom Riddle is his real name and not a nickname. Sith Penguin Lord 22:45, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I vote for merge and redirect Lord Voldemort to Tom Marvolo Riddle. Create seperate sections in the biography for each - you could even include two seperate infoboxes if you wanted to, but they really are the same person. DarkJedi613 22:51, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

This article needs to be deleated, and the Lord Voldemort article needs to be moved to Tom Riddle as thats his REAL name, Voldemort is an alias of Tom Riddle not the other way round.KickAssJedi 15:42, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

They should be merged and be titled Tom Riddle. It is the same ans Anakin Skywalker and Darth Vader from Star Wars.

I agree they should be merged. Tom Marvolo Riddle and Lord Voldemort are the same person, and it is not proper to have two different articles about him. Akwdb 02:07, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Why is everyone in HP afraid of saying Lord Voldemort
Everyone in the real world isn't.. Well I suppose it's because some people don't actually think they'll get hurt.. But some people may have bad dreams about other people they like being dead....

This is really not the place. HPisawesome 23:44, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Is his name Thomas or just Tom?Me_Potter_Fan 09:54, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
 * He's always referred to as "Tom" in the books. So as far as we know its just Tom. Plus "Tom Marvolo Riddle" -> "I am Lord Voldemort" wouldn't work if his name was Thomas. ;) -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 12:27, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

How do we know he died on may 23?
I cant find any evidence of that all we know is it was may.Me_Potter_Fan 14:53, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Recent Edit
Recent edit was done by me, I guess I wasn't logged in. Mafalda Hopkirk 21:50, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Minister of Magic
I don't believe the books ever mention Voldemort being the Minister of Magic - M a t o r o 183  (R a v e n claw) 23:16, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

It says de fato doesnt it


 * It didn't say that when I posted the comment...User:Matoro183 19:49, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

His own dead body?
Was this mentioned in any of the books? His boggart? Or did I just skip the page? 90.206.108.111 18:48, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I believe its from an interview. I don't have a link at the moment though. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 21:06, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

Mastery of Etc
I'm not sure the "Master Dark Wizard" and other things really fit, it sounds a little like video game acheivements and i can't remember anywhere it being stated he's a Master Dark Wizard. This goes for the other bolded 'ranks' too. Mafalda Hopkirk 04:59, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree. That section could use some work. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 05:21, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Would it be appropriate to revert to the edit that precedes it? Mafalda Hopkirk 10:39, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I've undone it User:Matoro183 13:50, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Picture
I feel that it is necessary to have a picture of T M Riddle as a boy (possibly from the CS movie) next to the picture of Voldemort, on this page. Two pictures wouldn't be necessary, rather two images put into one picture file. Mafalda Hopkirk 22:16, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You mean in the main infobox picture? - Cavalier One ( Wizarding Wireless Network ) 22:18, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes the one visiters see when they first open the page. Mafalda Hopkirk 22:46, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Interesting idea. I would say body shots rather than head shots would be better, since I don't believe two head shots side by side will show up well.  Also, it might be an idea to hold off for a while until we get an official image of the new actor playing Riddle in Half-Blood Prince? -  Cavalier One ( Wizarding Wireless Network ) 23:18, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
 * The pic of him in the Chamber of Secrets is such a good pic, he looks really handsome there, but if there's a better pic, i have no real preference. Mafalda Hopkirk 01:47, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
 * At one point we had a picture of Tom Riddle and a picture of Voldemort below it but I belive the picture of Tom Riddle was removed as it isn't who he is "now". Personally I think there should be a picture of him as Tom somewhere near the top, not necessarily in the infobox though. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 04:07, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
 * It's not a case of a better pic of him, but a more recent picture. The new actor that will be portraying him might be the better choice.  However, since we may not have a picture of him for ages yet, lets go with the CoS one.  Do we have the one you have in mind uploaded Mafalda? -  Cavalier One ( Wizarding Wireless Network ) 12:11, 31 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree we should have the main image of him as riddle rather than voldemort, as thats the name of the article. Speaking of which I hate to pick at an old bone but I beleive that the title of the article should be Tom Riddle as opposed to Tom Marvolo Riddle as its wiki policy not to include middle names or titles in the article name. - Lord KAJ  – Company Office 17:52, 31 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Is this the image you mean Mafalda? [[Image:FullRiddle.jpg|thumb|right|250px]]. - Lord KAJ  – Company Office 17:58, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

That picture is great. I think the Marvolo should be included though, because there are two other Tom Riddles preceding him. Also, because of the fact the letters of his name make up I Am Lord Voldemort. Mafalda Hopkirk 00:40, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Move
I think this article should be moved to Voldemort. As Dumbledore says Riddle shed his name and became Voldemort almost as soon as he arrived at Hogwarts, when he discovered that his father who he was named for was a muggle. Furthemore he has used the name for nearly his entire life and noboady other than Dumbledore infrequantly calls him Tom. Most importantly its the name he dies under which is usually the deciding factor in wether an article should be moved or not. With all this in mind I feel that moving it to Voldemort, (not Lord Voldemort as it was before, as titles dont go in the article name) would be best, with Tom Marvolo Riddle redirecting to it. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 18:54, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * As "Voldemort" redirects to this page anyway, I don't see the difference, moreover "Lord Voldemort" is an alias and not his real name. Mafalda Hopkirk 19:00, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

The diffrence is that to the entire world he is Voldemort not Tom Riddle. Dumbledore himself says very few people knew his birth name. Moreover the Ministry of Magic itself call him voldemort so it seems likely he changed his name officialy. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 19:25, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * While I can see the validity is using either name, this is a decision that needs to be taken by the community since the article is about one of the main characters. I would suggest taking it to the Forum for a vote. -  Cavalier One ( Wizarding Wireless Network ) 19:31, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Such votes are normally held on the articles talk page, here. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 19:33, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Then place it here. However, I believe it would garner more attention in the Forums. -  Cavalier One ( Wizarding Wireless Network ) 19:37, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

I will leave it to you, you know best. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 19:40, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Wasn't this discussion already held at the top of the page, with the merging of the articles?User:Matoro183 01:01, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, Matoro is right. This discussion has already taken place with the decision to merge the articles into "Tom Marvolo Riddle".  "Voldemort" as well as "Lord Voldemort", etc. already link to this page and it is the same page for all intensive purposes. It will not help the Wiki to continously move pages around. We decided to merge into "Tom Marvolo Riddle" a la Wookieepedia using "Anakin Skywalker" as an article title instead of "Dark Vader." While, although not part of this Wiki, is an established source of basic policies that we have been using when our own are lacking. This was the decision before and I really do not feel this needs to be rediscussed. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 01:33, 30 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Ah but the Anakin Skywalker article is that for a reason, because he was redeemed before he died, and died as Anakin Skywalker just as Tom Riddle died as Voldemort. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 09:23, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I cant understand why this arguament keeps coming up they are the exact same person called Tom Marvolo Riddle and if you use the arguament that he became Voldemort after he split his soul remember that his "friends" were calling him Voldemort before that. Me_Potter_Fan 09:34, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't call it an argument, but yes it has been discussed before. You are right Me Potter Fan he became Voldemort shortly after arriving at hogwarts, upon discovering his father was a muggle. There are three main points to consider in cases such as this, 1: Which name was the character best known as, 2: Which name did the character use for most of their life, 3: Which name did the character die under. In the case of this article all three points are Voldemort. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 09:57, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes he was best known as Lord Voldemort and he did use it for most of his life but he was never officially recognised as Voldemort his name was always Tom Marvolo Riddle. Whenever Dumbledore talked to him he called him Tom, At the end of the battle of hogwarts Harry started calling him and when he dies JKR says "Tom Riddle hit the floor with a mundane finality". In my opinion renaming this page Lord Voldemort would be exactly like renaming Snape's page The Half-Blood Prince. Me_Potter_Fan 10:13, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Not quite, Snape was never known publically as the Prince it was a private name he called himself. As for Dumbledore, he himself says that old teachers never forget their students youthfull beginings, and he calls him Voldemort more than he does riddle anyway. Harry was simply trying to goad Voldemort into attacking him as he knew the Elder Wand would destroy Voldemort. And too quote that exact paragraph, Tom Riddle hit the floor with a mundane finality, his body feeble and shrunken the white hands empty, the snake-like face vacant and unknowing. Voldemort was dead, killed by his own rebounding curse, and Harry stood with two wands in his hand, staring down at his enemy's shell. So actually Voldemort is the last thing he is called. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 10:30, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Or she is saying Voldemort is dead, but there's a little part of Tom Riddle left. Regardless, the reasoning behind having the Anakin Skywalker article name that, as far as I know, is because that is his name. It was not the name he was best known as, but it was his real name. Its similar to having titles in the article titles, like Mr. or Sir, its not part of their name so it shouldn't be there. His real name is Tom Riddle. Also I don't see why you would ignore "which name the character was born as" in your conclusions of what an article title should be. Snape and the Half-Blood Prince perhaps was a bad example, but what about something along the lines of "Harry Potter" and "The Boy that Lived" or some derivation of that? Most people knew him as both...regardless, continue discussing -- just everyone remember to be civil to one another. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 12:09, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh I wasn't ignoring it, its just that as Anakin Skywalker was used as an example I thought I would point those three out as there the ones used by Wookiepedia. In any case the Anakin Skywalker article is so because he died under that name. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 13:18, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * The way the article is set up now is the best, i think, and it seems the majority of people here agree. Why mess with something that isn't broken, i wonder. Mafalda Hopkirk 16:21, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Well it's a matter of correctness more than anything. Anakin Skywalker has been used an example but it should be pointed out that that article is titled Anakin Skywalker rather than Darth Vader, not becuse its his birth name but because its the name he died under, as is the case with most articles there. In this case he lived most of his life as Voldemort, was best known as Voldemort, and he died as Voldemort. I'd feel better if it was voted on, if then it was decided to leave as Riddle I will say no more about it, however if we follow policy Marvolo should be removed as Titles and Middle names are not supposed to go in the article title. - Vaysey  – Slytherin 17:57, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I think it was already voted on? The Marvolo is included because it's instrumental in creating his new name, "I Am Lord Voldemort," remember? And, also because his father and grandfather were also named Tom Riddle. I'm just wondering, would you also contend then that Rubeus Hagrid's article be just called Hagrid because nobody ever refers to him as Rubeus? Mafalda Hopkirk 18:01, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Can you please point me to the policy of not including middle names in article titles? We've already voted and decided as a community on this. There is nothing left to discuss. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 21:23, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Relation to Harry Potter
On JKR's official site she said that Harry is NOT related to Voldemort. Yet in a later interview she contradicted herself by saying that Voldemort and Harry were distantly related by the Peverells. I was wondering what we should put under family. Dumblydoor 20:42 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I think she means related through marriage, not blood. Mafalda Hopkirk 01:45, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Yes, but I meant should we put he is related to Harry or not? Dumblydoor 07:07 31 January 2008 (UTC)
 * They are very distant cousins. According to our guidelines concerning family, distant relations are to be kept off the infobox to avoid cluttering the family section.  However, there is room for special exceptions to be made if it is felt to be necessary. -  Cavalier One ( Wizarding Wireless Network ) 12:23, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Which House?
Was voldemort sorted into Ravenclaw or Slytherin? in the picture of the young tom riddle, he is shown wearing a blue tie and shirt, like a Ravenclaw student. But Slytherins are shown wearing green ties/shirts
 * He was definitely in Slytherin. Salazar Slytherin is his ancestor. --Cubs Fan2007 02:54, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

If Voldemort is in Slytherin, why is he wearing a blue(Ravenclaw) tie instead of the normal slytherin green? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.144.228.97 (talk • contribs).
 * Great observation! I think it might be either because he was a "memory" and maybe his colouring was changed, notice how pale and translucent his skin looks - or perhaps it is a Flint? <--- Mafalda H, who can't log in —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.105.169.66 (talk • contribs).
 * That's weird. The tie is blue and silver, but the colors on the sweater are silver and green.--M atoro <font face="Tahoma" color="#404040">183 <font style="font-family:Arial;font-size:8;color:#112846">(Talk) 17:00, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Its very possible that its just the particular reflection/lighting in that picture that is making the green look like blue. (Are we referring to Image:FullRiddle.jpg?) I'd be curious to see if its like that in every picture or what. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 17:13, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
 * That's the picture I was referring to. If you take a good look you can tell it's green though.<font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#112846">M <font face="Microsoft Sans Serif" color="#112846">atoro <font face="Tahoma" color="#404040">183 <font style="font-family:Arial;font-size:8;color:#112846">(Talk) 17:59, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Vol-De-More?
Everything I have heard, J.K.Rowling, Actors, everyone pronounces it with the "T" can we get a source on this please? SilverSword 23:20, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure it is Voldemort, with the T pronounced. Mort means death in French. KH 23:33, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
 * In an interview with The Orange County Register on 26 October 1999, ("Enchanted with Potter Literature: Fans line up for hours to get their books signed" by Valerie Takahama), Rowling responded this way to the question of pronouncing Voldemort's name:
 * "Is it Voldemort?" "Or Voldemor?" someone asked about Harry's evil nemesis.
 * "I say 'Voldemor' but I'm the only one," replied Rowling, pronouncing the name with a silent "t." <font face="Microsoft Sans Serif" color="#112846">Me_Potter_Fan <font face="Arial" style="font-family:Arial;font-size:8;color:#112846">(Talk) 00:12, 7 July 2008 (UTC)
 * JK didn't really specify according to that. That's the first time I have ever heard of Voldemort having a silent t.--<font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#112846">M <font face="Microsoft Sans Serif" color="#112846">atoro <font face="Tahoma" color="#404040">183 <font style="font-family:Arial;font-size:8;color:#112846">(Talk) 01:28, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Me_Potter_Fan, do you have a source? -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 03:04, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * <font face="Microsoft Sans Serif" color="#112846">Me_Potter_Fan <font face="Arial" style="font-family:Arial;font-size:8;color:#112846">(Talk) 03:54, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Really according to our Canon policy the correct pronuciation is what JKR says it is. I think it should be noted in the article with  as a source. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 20:16, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Marvolo

 * I think Marvolo should be removed from the article title. None of the other characters have their middle names in the titles, and yes I know it's part of the "I am Lord Voldemort" anagram thing, but to be honest it's not that important and it makes the title overly long. Unless were going to mover Harry Potter to Harry James Potter, and so on we shouldnt make exeptions. - –K.A.J•T•C•E• 15:19, 29 July 2008 (UTC)


 * This is from the Wikipedia policy on naming conventions. Do not include middle names unless the person is primarily known by the expanded name.–K.A.J•T•C•E• 15:39, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
 * If we removed the middle name, we would also have to move the disambig page that already exists under that name. Personally, I like the name as is.-- 17:04, 29 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah but it doesnt take any effort to move a page and like I said we cant make exceptions, either we remove Marvolo or all other characters need to have their middle names added. –K.A.J•T•C•E• 17:09, 29 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I think it should stay. There are two other Tom Riddles. Adding the "Marvolo" to this one complicates things a lot less. And I would say that he is more primarily known as "Tom Marvolo Riddle" than "Tom Riddle". 17:19, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The Marvolo helps distinguish between the other two riddle articles.-- 17:23, 29 July 2008 (UTC)